26 replies to this topic

[ironbrew]

To get off with 3v1 against current Spain team is far from a disgrace though they don`t tend to hammer teams (lots of possession not many goals) and to progress we`ll need to improve against more modest teams but I think fitness was one issue last night .Players looked knackered, completely normal given heat and quality of opposition but also because we were playing second game in 3 days while Spain were able to rest players and had an extra day`s rest. In next qualifiers, group doesn`t have one outstanding team so every match will count and none of the teams can afford to rest top players (Wales wouldn`t rest Bale while Spain can rest Xavi for example)-when arranging fixtures, especially for last 2 matches, it should be taken into account. If we can`t play on Fridays, then try not to play on Tuesdays where possible.

[ianp]

Excellent lead post. A school coach could see last night (and lately) that standing off and getting deeper does not suit us and also does not win points. How many times last night did Spain have 2 players going down the flanks and we went very narrow. Sorry guys but our Craig has not improved things much, yes he is better at PR and a few new faces have been introduced but have we improved as a team? Have been at all of the qualifiers and we have been 2nd best at all but 2 games against Liechtenstein and 1 against Lithuania. Yes we should have done better against Czech Rep, but they were the better team in both games. So where is the improvement apart from the PR, sorry Craig book a taxi ASAP!!!!!!!!!

[GLOSTA]

It was mesmerising to see the best team the world has ever produced give very coach and player a lesson on how football should be played with pace, skill, energy, and tempo. We got thumped but just to be there and see them was a privilege.

Stand off? We couldn't get near them to stand off them. BUT, had Naysmith scored with the diving header, Fletcher put his away and Goodwille crossed to CMS for the tap in we would have won 4-3!

We showed promise and NO, we shouldn't try and play junior football, we should learn how to play international football

[A96]

Confidence is everything in fitba. A decent run of results would see a different Scotland team - one with swagger, invention and a desire to really get in about the opposition. Our guys are decent players but under-rated and still look a bit nervous - whether against Spain or the mighty Lichtenstein. Any team looks good when they've had success and their tails are up.

I just hope we get that much needed run of results before too long.

[rtg]

Excellent lead post. A school coach could see last night (and lately) that standing off and getting deeper does not suit us and also does not win points.

tell that to the dutch who harried and kicked the utter crap out of Spain to er.......oh aye lose.

How many times last night did Spain have 2 players going down the flanks and we went very narrow.

whats wrong with that? that is exactly what defenders should do. Narrow is where the danger is. ball goes wide whole defence moves across. Schoolboy coaching!!

So where is the improvement apart from the PR, sorry Craig book a taxi ASAP!!!!!!!!!

and replace with..........????

[Louie]

Said exactly this last night during the game. You see it anytime Rangers or Celtic drop points in the League it's nearly always because whoever there playing gives them no time on the ball and is constantly on there heels niggling. Obviously different skill levels but if a team is generally better than you, you have to keep harassing them not standing off and giving them time and space to play. Although to be fair we still would of got beat and i think we did alright considering

You have a point about poor quality teams in Scotland taking points off Celtic and Rangers when they don't give them time on the ball. So take that argument to the next level. Does it work for Celic and Rangers in Europe where they are the poor quality teams? I don't think so as the average teams in Europe tend to beat them by keeping the ball and being far more skillful. The top European sides make our two biggest teams look like little boys lost.! Football has moved on since the days of get right into them and is now more about keeping the ball, passing and moving and where appropriate hunting the ball down to get it back. Players at the very top are comfortable getting the ball in tight positions, intantly controlling it and moving it on. I thought it interesting to watch the pre match warm up in Spain. Scotland were running about on the pitch and Spain were paying 5 against 5 in a tight square with a maximum of two touches to see how long each 5 could could keep the ball.

[blueboy]

"Football has moved on since the days of get right into them and is now more about keeping the ball, passing and moving and where appropriate hunting the ball down to get it back. Players at the very top are comfortable getting the ball in tight positions, intantly controlling it and moving it on."

That's what I'm talking about. I don't mean that we should get in about them aggressively in a dirty way, or try to kick them off the park. I am saying that we should get in far closer to them, harrass them, and don't give them time and space on the ball. Don't give them time to think. We should rush them into the next pass, or better still, stop the pass entirely.

At the moment we seem to just give the opposition (whoever they may be that's playing against us at the time) space and time to pick passes at will and we only get the ball back it we are fortunate enough to intercept a pass, or if a move breaks down, or if their shot at goal goes behind, or worse still their shot at goal goes in and we get to kick-off again. Very seldom do you actually see us tackle or even make an attempted tackle. It's as if we have somehow agreed to accept that the opposition gets to attack us and if we survive their attack we'll then counter attack, rather than make some sort of conserted effort to go out and try to get the ball back off them before they have the chance to complete their whole manoeure.

That's why I think we need the team to have more tenacity, more guille, more bite and not just accept that when the opposition attacks we should automatically fall back en-mass and wait for them to get to our box.

Edited by blueboy, 13 October 2011 - 09:08 PM.

[King Of Paisley]

I might get shot down for this but perhaps we might, just might, have missed Scott Brown last night. It would have been difficult, but he was the sort of player who might have tried to get in about Xavi in particular and try and unsettle him with a few early dunts. Then again, that task would have been as easy as nailing jelly to a brick wall!

[lee-lang]

"Football has moved on since the days of get right into them and is now more about keeping the ball, passing and moving and where appropriate hunting the ball down to get it back. Players at the very top are comfortable getting the ball in tight positions, intantly controlling it and moving it on."

That's what I'm talking about. I don't mean that we should get in about them aggressively in a dirty way, or try to kick them off the park. I am saying that we should get in far closer to them, harrass them, and don't give them time and space on the ball. Don't give them time to think. We should rush them into the next pass, or better still, stop the pass entirely.

At the moment we seem to just give the opposition (whoever they may be that's playing against us at the time) space and time to pick passes at will and we only get the ball back it we are fortunate enough to intercept a pass, or if a move breaks down, or if their shot at goal goes behind, or worse still their shot at goal goes in and we get to kick-off again. Very seldom do you actually see us tackle or even make an attempted tackle. It's as if we have somehow agreed to accept that the opposition gets to attack us and if we survive their attack we'll then counter attack, rather than make some sort of conserted effort to go out and try to get the ball back off them before they have the chance to complete their whole manoeure.

That's why I think we need the team to have more tenacity, more guille, more bite and not just accept that when the opposition attacks we should automatically fall back en-mass and wait for them to get to our box.

Totally 100% with you mate..

[ULSTERSCOTAS]

Yes many interesting points in these analyses and to add some thoughts which really just pull it together a bit :-
Thought we played ok against Spain, not at a high enough level to really threaten them but if we'd played at that level in all the games then we'd certainly have got second spot in the group. Fitba now does seem to be about two fundamental activities which the top teams do very effectively - find space when you're in possession and deny space when you're not. I think it's just that if you've got space then that gives you time to properly control the ball and pick a pass. Agree that we have a lot of catching up to do before we can do that like Spain and Barca. Don't believe it is beyond us though. Think that unusually for Scotland we have a problem in the middle of defence where Berra and Caldwell are a bit ponderous and not decisive enough, Craig Levein has to get it into his and the players heids that there is nobody in this world cup group that we can't beat at hampden or take something off away from home. He should be thinking about how to win the ffing group and get us tae Brazil for the party we all deserve!!!!!!!!!!

[gonzoal]

It was mesmerising to see the best team the world has ever produced give very coach and player a lesson on how football should be played with pace, skill, energy, and tempo. We got thumped but just to be there and see them was a privilege.

Stand off? We couldn't get near them to stand off them. BUT, had Naysmith scored with the diving header, Fletcher put his away and Goodwille crossed to CMS for the tap in we would have won 4-3!

We showed promise and NO, we shouldn't try and play junior football, we should learn how to play international football

Exactly what is the point of 2 or 3 players getting close to the opposition player who has the ball but not one of them trying to pressurise him let alone get a tackle in? It's not just the Spain game this happened in. If you give people room and time then they have a better chance of doing what THEY want with it than if you harry them and put them under pressure. Doesn't mean you dive in just don't give them all that time and space. OK the good oppositioin may still take tha\t time and space from us but that doesn't mean we have to stand back and give them it as the OP said.

Also we have a habit of backing off and backing off until all the defending is done in our 18 yard line when one mistake can directly result in a goal. Why do we not start defending further up the pitch? At least mistakes there have a chance of being rectified.

How often have we tried to defend a one goal lead in this very manner? How often has that tactic been successful? The sad thing is it's been the case under successive managers not just the current one.

Edited by gonzoal, 24 October 2011 - 08:57 PM.

[wrighty]

.......s'funny............i always thought it was because we have the English as oor neighbours????