144 replies to this topic

[John D]

What an awful programme.

agreed.

i don't even think highlighting the stinking racism was the purpose.

[dandydunn]

So you have never seen fans attacked at club games in Scotland?

What league do Scotland play in then,is that the name of the newco??????

[jimstroma]

Read what I said again

IMO the reporter was highlighting racist issues in Poland and Ukraine because there is a problem. You stated that you have only seen fans attacked in Ukraine. I have witnessed fans being attacked at games in Scotland and England.

[Lamia]

You stated that you have only seen fans attacked in Ukraine.

No I didn't

[EvilScotsman]

Without wishing to sound, er, racist, Eastern Europe is a pretty brutal place - understandable to an extent given what people there have endured over the centuries.

On racism, someone recently pointed out that they're probably where Western Europe was thirty / forty years ago in terms of attitudes. I'm not sure shutting them out (by not allowing tournaments to be held there) will help move things forward; it was the introduction of black players in noticeable numbers that helped to shift attitudes elsewhere (not that it should take that for people to open their minds).

As repellent as it may be, some good may come of getting this out into the open.

It's a fair point, but I would have liked to have seen the Ukrainian/Polish FA's produce some kind of evidence that they were attempting to tackle the problem before they were awarded the honour of hosting the tournament. Maybe they did, I'm not long in from work so I've no seen the documentary yet, I can only go on the clips they showed on the news. I'm not sure I actually want to watch it!

Now I think about it, I'm fairly sure they only mentioned the Ukraine on the news, so my mention of the Polish FA may be erroneous.

Edited by EvilScotsman, 28 May 2012 - 09:37 PM.

[andy smiff]

The only time i have ever felt properly unsafe was in Ukraine. I was actually quite happy to take the defeat and get the hell out of the country. I'm sure people had a great time there and met loads of friendly people but i certainly wouldn't be rushing back and would struggle to enjoy myself if i ever did.

[dave the bankie]

I was close to the both attacks in Kiev , The Ukranians blamed Russians for trying to disrupt their bid for the Tourno , generally I enjoyed Ukraine and the people and a few arseholes did not spoil my trip

[WillfaeSwindon]

Myself and Leon had a good time in Kiev. We managed to avoid getting attacked in the square and were not part of the march to the Stadium that got attacked. We did however, hear monkey noises and other pleasant ditties. After the game we then had a group of neonazi-esque neanderthals chase us up the street and try and drag us out of a taxi. We could have been in serious trouble if it wasnt for the taxi driver.

I said at the time that there was no way Poland and Ukraine should host the tournament, but UEFA and FIFA dont give a fúck. All they care about is the dollars. No doubt Rinat Akhmetov greased a few palms in Switzerland!

[Lamia]

It's a fair point, but I would have liked to have seen the Ukrainian/Polish FA's produce some kind of evidence that they were attempting to tackle the problem before they were awarded the honour of hosting the tournament. Maybe they did, I'm not long in from work so I've no seen the documentary yet, I can only go on the clips they showed on the news. I'm not sure I actually want to watch it!

Now I think about it, I'm fairly sure they only mentioned the Ukraine on the news, so my mention of the Polish FA may be erroneous.

All we saw was "sweep sweep"

[Cove_Sheep]

Of course you can. The stewards don't want to get a battering themselves.

The most disturbing thing is that the coppers did f*ck all about it. In fact, if you take what the chief of police said, they'll deny it ever happened and have a good laugh later.

The boy on about the nazi salutes reminded me of the Rangers defence of the red hand salute on a bbc documentary about sectarianism.

[Toepoke]

Fans attacking their own fans, absolutely mental!

The only time I've seen that in the flesh was at a Hungary game, and they blamed that on club rivalries. Which was almost understandable but still horrible to witness when you're sitting watching a game with your missus.

I hope this tournament passes without visiting fans getting hurt but I'm not too confident...

[Lion Rampant]

I'm going to the semi final game in Warsaw, and if I hadn't already been to Poland twice i'd maybe reconsider it. My experience of Poland is that if you're careful and keep your wits about you then you'll be fine. That probably goes for most major cities.

Quite a few of the stories about Ukraine however seem to suggest that even doing that may not save you from a kicking.

I think what we'll find is that all the games will pass off without incident within the stadium and the designated fan zones will be fine. If there is to be any trouble then it will be away from the ground and outwith the fan zones and the police and Uefa can sweep it aside and claim it had nothing to do with football

[SMcoolJ]

You think thats what they did?

Ukraine is the only place I have ever followed Scotland where fans were attacked. If I were English I wouldn't be rushing to go.

Easily the worst TA trip i've been on. Result and local food aside, I felt pretty uncomfortable in Kiev. I appreciate that turning up in hoards, wearing kilts and being boozy lends itself to unwanted attraction, but i'm using the same point of reference for all TA trips i've been on. There was a dodgy undercurrent in Kiev and i wasn't really surprised at the attacks in the centre. I agree with you, i wouldn't go there again as a football fan. let alone a non-white one.

[Geed]

Horrible viewing for a football fan, feel sorry for all the decent football fans and people in poland and ukraine who want to enjoy the tournament but live in fear of idiotic racists. The majority of people in Poland and ukraine am sure are nice people but always get idiots in every country like that, Usa, England, New Zealand, Australia etc its a problem that still exists in alot of countries.

[Rossy]

Horrible viewing for a football fan, feel sorry for all the decent football fans and people in poland and ukraine who want to enjoy the tournament but live in fear of idiotic racists. The majority of people in Poland and ukraine am sure are nice people but always get idiots in every country like that, Usa, England, New Zealand, Australia etc its a problem that still exists in alot of countries.

Yeap, but in any civilised 21st century country these racists are marginalised, arrested and prosecuted whenever possible.

The problem in places like Poland and the Ukraine is that there's really no official will to tackle the problem. In fact, it's probably condoned.

I dare say that political pressure will be exerted on the police and army to make the tournament as trouble free as possible, but it's hard to see anything other than them going back to the year zero after the tournament finishes.

Edited by Rossy, 29 May 2012 - 12:31 PM.